Things Believers Say… Part 1

The other day, the world/Internet was offered this nugget of wisdom:

“I am the vine;
you are the branches.
If a man remains in me and I in him,
he will bear much fruit;
apart from me you can do nothing.”

——————-
(John 15:5)

 

Being a curious sort, I asked about that

How does this account for all the things done by humans without god? Without your god? As a species we’ve been pretty busy of late – exploration of all kinds, understanding the world around us much better, using that understanding to fix and prolong the life of the human body, replace organs, grow new ones, and on and on, much of it based on evolutionary biology. Is all that the ‘nothing’ we can do apart from god, your god?

Apparently, such advice is only for those that want comfort from an invisible sky daddy to look over them. The reply was no explanation at all, rather a sort of curt ‘well, go do it on your own then’ kind of thing.

Thanks for the visit. Those who don’t want God can walk away and look to themselves. Those who respond to Him can find someone who loves the real person inside – the one so many of us find unlovable -, someone who wants them and will not discard them. There we may find a peace we thought impossible, and a value that goes beyond today into endless tomorrows.
The world for all its cleverness is not a happy or healthy place – most of its people live in poverty, western economies are still close to disaster, violence and abuse is commonplace, the potential for war lurks around us and there is a lack of integrity and trustworthiness in high office – and it could well get worse … Travel your journey well, we get once chance.

So, if you believe it is true, then it works and you can feel like there is love for you no matter what – even if there really isn’t. We all know that it is much better to pretend things are okay than it is to actually do something to make them okay.

Sure, if it gets them through the day, that is all good and well. What is to stop them from insisting that children be taught that this is truth in their science classes? What is to stop such folk from promoting dogma as policy or suppressing the rights of others in accordance with their dogma?

This is what worries me about the ‘moderate’ believers or those who create their own religions. Are they still siding with the facts as we know them? Will they side with those that want to suppress my rights? And lets look at the reasoning offered:

The world for all its cleverness is not a happy or healthy place –This has been true for millions of years.

most of its people live in poverty – This has been true for millions of years

western economies are still close to disaster – This has been true for hundreds of years

violence and abuse is commonplace – This has been true for millions of years

the potential for war lurks around us – This has been true for thousands upon tens of thousands of years

there is a lack of integrity and trustworthiness in high office –This has been true since before the first human society

and it could well get worse – This will never be false, and if it becomes false, we won’t care.

It would do the reader well to note that in all those years religion has not changed a thing for the better.

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  1. Ramen!

    • LOL, thanks

  2. Hi Mal,
    You don’t know that the world wouldn’t be worse though, without God, do you? Without a loving God, maybe we would have annihilated ourselves, especially now that we have the plutonium bomb. Maybe this loving God is all that’s keeping this crazy, crazy world’s people – together. Maybe without Him we would have smashed ourselves into a million pieces. I was smashed into a million pieces when I met Him, and He’s the one that put me back together again. I know this is true because I know that, before I allowed Him into my sphere, I was a gonner.

    • That’s a lot of ‘maybes’ and far too many to say that what we’ve been doing is correct. Maybe without gods we would have given up on war thousands of years ago. Maybe without gods we would already be populating earth 2.0. Maybe without gods we would not be worried about global warming. Maybe without gods we would have no starvation on the planet. Maybe without gods we would not have out of control population growth. Maybe… well, you get the picture. Maybe statements without some evidence are worth little, if anything.

      What we do know is that we’ve had religion for more than 5000 years. The world we live in could be a much better place. Wars are almost always fought due to religion in some way. Religion is not feeding starving people and so on and on.

      • So…. touche on the “maybe” thing. And I’ll let it go at that.

        • Okay….

  3. I think now I know why it’s so interesting to debate with believers about their beliefs: they always leave so many gaps in their debates that it’s like shooting fish in a barrel. It’s not like a debate between two people about, say, a political conflict, where both sides try their best to ensure that their statements are water-tight. Those debates can be frustrating because you might have a difficult time coming up with what to say next in response. Not so, as this blog demonstrates, with debates about religion with believers. 🙂

    • It’s not so much about the debate, rather it’s about getting people to think. First if they will think that atheist does not mean satanic etc. then secondly if they will think about their own beliefs and whether or not they actually make sense. I have hope.

      • You mean, you don’t burn Bibles and worship Satan over the flames at home in your spare time like me? Hmmm…. Maybe I had a misunderstanding about atheism…

        • No. Tried it of course. Satan is as useless as the gods. None of these supernatural entities seem to respond. Not so super if you ask me. Not natural either. All of it is a waste of time as far as I can see. You’d think that if you worshipped right you could have a weed free lawn… wrong.

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